This AI Saas Makes $7m per month | GoHighLevel

Meet Shawn Clark. He's the CEO and co-founder of GoH High Level, one of the fastest growing all-in-one platforms used by agencies everywhere. He's built a tool that replaces 10 softwares, earned massive traction, and today he's here to share the playbook.

Sean, how are you doing today?

I'm doing great. Thanks for having me.

Amazing. So before we before I hound you with questions about AI and AI agents and different softwares uh I wanted to kind of start from the beginning like how did go high level start?

Yeah sure. So I had a prior SAS company in the accounts receivable space and I really wanted to help small businesses with that and what I learned is all of them wanted the same thing. They wanted more customers and so uh when I started high level I did it with my u our CTO and co-founder still Verun and we built the sort of this basic app that did two-way text messaging and reputation management and we started selling it to small businesses but the reality was we very quickly ran into the the fact that they didn't have the time to learn how to put the technology in place and so we're really kind of at this weird place where on one hand they would say it's great we need it but on the other hand they said oh we don't time to do it. And lucky for us, we got a call uh like a cold call, random call from a a guy who was working with one of our customers at the time. And what he really told us was, look, you know, if you want to help these small businesses, you need to help the agencies that help these small businesses. And so, you know, what what we realized is, you know, what we were doing wasn't working. So, we pivoted. So, we said, all right, that's all we're going to do. We're not going to help the small businesses. We're going to help the agencies. And it was a miracle because really that was the truth. there was all of these amazing folks in the background there already helping people and we just didn't know they were there. Nobody knew there because they just don't get the credit they deserve and so but thank thankfully to us we kind of had that door opened and we were able to kind of focus on those folks and kind of the rest is history.

Amazing. And just to give user like uh people watching this or listening to this context on how big is GoHigh level right now, can you give some numbers behind how big it is? How many countries?

Yeah, we serve about 3 million customers today. Um, and we're bigger than HubSpot, if that helps.

Wow. Okay, that's that's incredible. Uh, and I I've heard really good things in the last couple of years like ghost go high level has become really good. And

that's the goal.

And I think what people find it interesting is instead of jumping from 10 different softwares, you just have one this dashboard. And on top of that, you can add sub accounts where you can add

Oh, yeah. Yep. 100%. You can add

That's one of the greatest features out there.

I agree. It is awesome. And and it's really in recognition of agencies, right? Because if you're an agency and you've worked for five minutes in the industry, you have five clients, you're logging in and out of five different softwares, different usernames, all this. And then most of the time it's not five, it's like 25 because you know they have software for this and software for that. So if you put it all in one stack, you create uh this beautiful ability to most importantly actually it it allows for the data for that actual customer to be seamless, right? From the CRM to the landing page, the analytics to the payment systems all being that data orchestration being in the same system really allows you to do things like, you know, ROI tracking is is is possible, right? Like, hey, I bought this ad and I bought this click for 10 cents or a buck 50 or $25, but what did I get? how much money did I get out of it? You can't do that in any system unless you have all the data in one spot. So, that helps. And then going up a level, if you have those five clients, now you can jump in and out as the as the agency very seamlessly. Um, and you don't have to worry about logging in and out of a bunch of different software.

And you were working on a different software company, Invoice Sherpa, before this. Uh,

yeah, that was my previous SAS company.

What was that company about?

Oh, well, a lot of small businesses send out invoices and they'll get paid on time. And that was really just automating the invoice reminders uh that go out uh to those folks.

And uh what made you decide to switch from that to go high level? It was just a bigger idea.

Well, I mean I Yeah. So I had about a thousand small business customers. I had taken that product as far as I could figure out how to take it and I really wanted to do more and and I talked to my customers then like I talked to them now and they all wanted more customers and so I thought well how can I how can I you know how can I keep that journey going and with that product I couldn't do it and so I knew I needed something else and right about that time I got a random cold call actually to buy the company and so I ended up selling that um as a way to get out and actually get time to uh work on this.

Got it. And let me ask you a very common question you must guess get asked a lot which from agency owners is um how do I acquire my first 100 or first 500 or first 10,000 users?

Very very very simple. Walk out your front door. Uh go to every business around your community. Stay in your community. Stay local. Don't focus on a niche at all. Focus on every business in your local community because they all need the same thing. They all want more customers. Go ask them, "Hey, do you want more customers?" No. No one's going to say, "Oh, no. No, I don't. No more money. No, thank you. I'm I'm good. No one's ever going to say that. They all want more customers. So, if you can do that for them, um then you're you're very you're amazing. And the cool thing is when you when you stay local, you have all this. So, sales is really no like and trust, right? It's like, you know, if you think about, well, why do you hire a dentist or a plumber or whatever? At some point, you sort of believe they can do what it is they say they can do or what you need done. And that's there's no difference there between you selling to a local business. The nice thing about local is you have a common connection and that starts to build that bridge of trust that you need. And so people who think, "Oh, I got I'm gonna I'm gonna, you know, focus on dentistry and I'm going to take the world of dentistry, you know, I'm going to do it." Yeah, you're not going to do that because the reality is you're going to try to be getting on Zoom calls with people. They don't know you. They don't like you. They don't trust you and you have nothing in common with them. So that is a terrible place to start if you are uh walking around talking to local businesses. The other thing is remember these local businesses already buy local. They serve local. They think local. So they like local. They want someone locally to help them. And many of their other vendors are, you know, if you think about most small businesses where they don't call national companies unless they can help unless they can't help it. So fundamentally the the person who fixes their lights, the person who fixes their toilets, the person who supplies often a lot of their goods, they're all local. In fact, the largest dental supply company um who is publicly traded and is national, the guy still drives up in a van every day. It's called Patterson Dental. Go look them up. They're a multi-billion dollar company. But from the local dentist perspective, it's the guy in the van and he and they call the guy in the van anytime they need more dental stuff. That's where you should focus. That's how you should start. That's how you will get your first 100 customers.

That is great advice. Um, and for people who are just start with like Facebook ads or cold calling, cold emailing, what do you tell them?

Good luck. Um, don't do that. That's a bad idea. Get out. Get out from behind your computer. Go meet people. Um, go to BNI meetings. Go to Chamber of Commerce meetings. You're not going to meet your local business owners by running Facebook ads and cold emailing people. Um, you need to you need to show that you're present because at the end of the day, let's say I do hire you, I believe what you're going to do and everything else, but how are you going to support me? So, like when you put up, you know, when you put these systems in place and I have a problem, I have a question. How do I get a hold of you? Do you show up? Like, are you a person or are you just somebody on a computer that I have no idea where you are? Like, doesn't work. H like, you know, technology can change all you want, but the way humans are built, like the way we've just evolved as a species, if you go look at it, it's not, hey, I I smoke signaled the guy down the valley to come help me save my village. No, no, no. We all lived in the village together. And that's how we created strength. That's how because you look at a lion or a tiger or a bear, we all lose as individuals against those animals, but as a team, we win. That has not gone away just because technology has made it easier for us to connect. So, if you really want to win, you got to appeal to the human side of people. that and that needs get out from behind your computer. Go to the local Chamber of Commerce meeting. Go to the Chamber of Commerce and say, "Hey, I'm going to do a free presentation, how to market your business online." Totally free. We have a help article on this, by the way, in our help docs on exactly how to do it. We have a slide deck. You just show up and you show people that you know what you're doing. And man, they'll trust you a lot more. And they'll say, "Oo, can you do that for me? Can you do that for me? How much can I pay you?" You'll get tons of customers. And I don't just know this because I'm telling you, I've seen it hundreds of times. So, don't start that way. It's a stupid way to start.

That's a great reminder for all the business owners out there. Um, proximity is power, right? Like you you can just go in in a 5 mile radius and find

Yeah. I mean, it does. And by the way, it doesn't mean, and this is I think the people feel like it's such a trade-off, like, oh well, if I do that way, then I'm not going to world domination. I've just I've shut myself off from world domination. But that's total nonsense. In fact, I always love there's an example of a company we actually compete with called Podium. If you go listen to the story of that guy, he started on the BYU campus and he walked around until he couldn't walk any farther. He got so far out he couldn't walk any farther, but he sold every business in his area first. And you know what that did for him? It gave him a base, a revenue base, a real business on which he could make money. And then he took that money and then he went to the telephone after that. So now fast forward to today and they've got thousands of customers. They're probably international. I have no idea. But point being is they started by walking around. So there's no world in which walking around is a limiter to you for future endeavors. But I will tell you it is always the opposite. The people who say no I refuse. I am going to sit on this computer and I am going to cold email my way my way to success or bust. Most of the time it's bust and it doesn't go well. So please don't make that mistake. H and uh one interesting thing about um the way you grew go level is the referral system right how how did how did that come about to be

uh oh well you know like most great ideas that I have been a part of they come to me for free and I always think they're terrible. So that was another example. So, my co-founder, my third co-founder, uh, who was actually the marketing agency who called us, by the way, who cold called us, who we had a co- customer comment with, he said, "Oh, we really should do this." And I said, "Oh, that's a stupid idea." So, I went out and bought the cheapest referral software I could find because I figured I would just be throwing money away. And as always with the with the best ideas, um, the ones that I think are the worst, they're always the best. And that one was awesome. And and you know what's funny is that is exactly how an agency should go as well. Back to the whole local thing. you get one business in your community who believes in you and you do a great job for, they talk to other business owners and you can incentivize that. You can say, "Listen, if you recommend somebody, they come in, I'll give you a month for free or something that they'll many of those people are happy to do it because they already have connections with other businesses." And that's exactly what we did um as well. It's, "Hey, did we do a good job for you? If so, is there anybody you know who might use the software?" And it's amazing how people are connected. And again, if you can get a re, we all know this as consumers. It's so funny. Where do you get your best recommendations? It's not Amazon. It's your friends. They say, "Hey, man. I bought this thing. I tried it out. It's amazing. You should check it out." And what do you do? You go off and buy it. Why? Not because you're you you're you know, you scrupulously look through the reviews or you watch thousands of YouTube videos. It's just because your friend who you trust had an experience with it and and knows that you might need it and then boom, you go and buy it. And so ultimately that's the same thing that's happening here but just on the business end

and initially like uh did you fund raise or did you have how did you put your own capital to build this offer?

No. Yeah. Own capital. And and and by the way anybody who says I hear a lot of people who like oh I'm just starting up and I have this great idea for a software product and this and that. I'm going to go fund raise. I'm like that's the dumbest idea because here's the problem with that. First of all you you don't know whether you're creating a sustainable model. Second of all, early fundraising. Oh my gosh, that is where you give up the most equity because you're you're literally going. So, imagine what you're doing. You're going to someone who has money and you're saying, "Hi, I have an idea or I have like almost nothing. Um, I want your money to make that a reality." If they are willing to do that, they're going to do so in exchange for an incredibly high price because they're assuming that the level of potential failure is very high. I mean, if anybody ever came to me and said that, I would say, "All right, I want 51% of your business." Um, and honestly, I would probably just say no to all of those things because I don't want to lose money. And fundamentally, that's what you're doing. So, and and and let's just say you you do that. Let's say you have a great idea and it's going to go really well. You are setting yourself up for future failure because you've given away such tremendous amounts of value to that person for this little amount of money. you would be better off to get that money from friends and family or or work a work a part-time job or I have whatever you got to do because if you have such a great idea and this is what we did. I mean uh you can be profitable the whole way through and if you do take money later on here's the magic of it. You get a lot more money for a lot less equity and you can actually and the other big thing is you can stay in control. You give money away early I'm telling you go look at founders who give money away early. They all end up as essentially just employees in the companies they built because they have no equity. They had to sell it all away to keep the lights on, to grow the sales team, to buy more Google ads, whatever it is, and they end up owning two 3% of the company. And that, you know, that's that sucks.

Yeah, that's a that's a fair point. And in your like experience running go high level, what was like one of the stories that the mo the most your favorite success story of a customer who joined GoHigh Level and then just

Oh, man. I mean, I've seen a million of them, right? But I I mean, but they're but they're all following the same pattern. Like, I remember there's this guy, he took a video and he was like, "Yeah, today's my last day at the car dealership. I my SAS I just hit 20 customers. I'm out of here." And, you know, it just really to me it's about the people who are able to step out of the thing that they that they don't want to be doing and and take a lot more control over their lives. And you know, you know, I can certainly think of examples where people sold their SAS and you know, did tens of millions of dollars doing it and all that and that's awesome and I think those people are fantastic, but but the people I love are the people that literally are, hey, I stepped out of the job I hate it or I, you know, I was able to do something for my family that I've always wanted to do. Like these things that are, I think, far more impactful um than than the people because at the bigger level, a lot of those people are really just compounding on something that they've been building for a long time. that, you know, hats off to them. But I love the number of people who can start from zero and get to something meaningful very quickly by going out and starting their own business um on top of HL. That to me is way more exciting than anything else.

And uh what kind of companies are these? Uh is it like any social media marketing agency, email marketing agency? What kind of businesses are there?

No, the tradition No, no, no. This these are SASR these are SASreneurs, man. So that the old agency models are dead. Going out and trading money for time, it it you're just a you're just an you're like a low paid employee. What you need to be doing is creating systems that are softwarebased, right? You need to be getting incremental recurring revenue that has 98% profit margins that when you add another customer, you're not doing some bespoke custom website or a bunch of custom uh social media posts. These are people that are creating recurring revenue businesses on top of high level the exact way we tell you to do it. I go out and go out to every small business to sell a missed call uh uh sorry inbound voice AI used to be missed call text back but now it's inbound voice AI and say hey listen I'm you know what I'm going to do for you I'm going to give you more customers off the calls you miss the calls you miss every day when you're out on the job or you're closed or when your receptionist is is greeting somebody walking through the door. Simple stuff like that is worth so much money for small businesses. Everybody I always ask the same question. Have you ever called a business and and not had them pick up? Oh, of course. And were you calling them because you wanted to chitchat or talk about the weather? No. You You were calling because you wanted to buy something. But when they didn't pick up, you had a need, right? Like your your toilet was overflowing or you wanted to get a new roof on your house. And what did you do when they didn't pick up? It's simple. You just call the next guy on the list. Well, if you put solutions in place like using AI now that you can use to answer all those calls 24/7, 365 when the business misses them, all of a sudden it takes like one customer to to to charge a business 300 bucks a month. I mean, the average plumbing job, the average roofing job, the average dental client makes way more than that. And you convert one a month, it's a very low bar. But most of these people, you're you're you're going to you're going to give them 10 or 20 or 30 new customers. And you could do this setup one time and you're not doing a bunch of custom work for them every month trying to keep them going. The old the old model that we came into of, oh, I'm a Facebook ads guy. I run Facebook ads for dentists, all this other stuff. $3,000 a month plus ad spend. Those guys got just murdered. They would get fired nonstop. Not because they were doing a bad job, by the way, because at the end of the day, the dentist, you know, what super high churn. And why is that? It wasn't because they weren't bringing in a lot of customers. It's because businesses, small businesses don't have the time to sit down and do the math. The the the dentist is just looking at that bill and like three grand. Good god, that new Mercedes down on the lot looks smoking awesome. I saw it this afternoon. If I kill this guy's bill, I'm boom, that Mercedes is mine. And that's it. That's all you got. You're gone. See you. See you later, sucker. He's going to go get that Mercedes over you every time. And and why is that? It's because three grand for any small business is way too much money. They just can't sustain it. And it's and it can be a mental hang-up. doesn't have to be an actual thing. You could be making them tens of thousands of dollars. You're just not going to see it. So, at the end of the day, when you do something that's softwarebased, you can bring the price way down. And now, all of a sudden, you look like the utility bill. You look like the phone bill or the power bell, right? You do not have a target on your back nearly like you would if you're doing the whole I'm a I'm a Facebook ads person or even a social media management person or Facebook or a a website person. You just look too expensive.

Okay. You gave one really good idea right now which is a inbound voice AI. Um is there any other ideas um that come to your mind?

Sure. Chat and the same thing inbound conversation AI chat widget on the website. The idea is you want to start with the remnant I call them remnant leads. They're leads that are just being missed. And we all know this. We've all been to websites where it's like super confusing. There's lots of links. This is why funnels actually work, right? Like what is a what what is a funnel versus a website? Simple. funnel is a is a onepage website without a menu. Why is that? Because you don't want people to get confused. But at the end of the day, when you go to a plumber's website, a lawyer's website, a doctor's website, or whatever, at some point you're like, okay, you look good, man. Now I want to transact. Where on the page do I go? And it's always hard. And oftentimes, oh, it's the book now button. Oh, oh, wait. It goes to a form. Oh, I I filled out these forms before. They go to somebody's inbox and those people never get back to me. This sucks. Well, guess what? What you want is you often ser if you're in a serious place you want to do you want to ask a couple of questions and then you want to move forward conversation AI is so good now it can do all that work for those businesses and every person that walks through that chat widget you as the provider you can take credit for those sales and ultimately again you only have to get a couple of sales in order to fundamentally get a $300 bill paid for for the end of time. Yeah, Mark and Recent said software is eating the world. Uh I really like how you explained that you need to find 98% margin software uh businesses that can scale.

Yeah. Well, that's well that's what that's what high level is.

Interesting. Uh

that's why you can that's why you can white label high level. I mean that's the whole point. You're turning yourself.

Are you guys using AI for the software at go high level?

We use AI everywhere. Where where do you want to go? We use AI on the on the programming side. We use AI on the support side. built a ton of AI into the software itself. You could there's AI assistants in the software that will build workflows, we'll build uh we'll build all kinds of we'll do social media posts, we'll create websites, we'll do chat, we'll do f phone calls, you name it, AI.

What's the next thing you guys are working on at GoHigh level?

Uh we're well two big things. So we'll have outbound voice AI. Well, actually we're to be fair, we're in a private beta right now with a bunch of customers on outbound voice AI. The big issue there isn't really the technology. It's really just the compliance because everyone wants to go be like, "Oh, I downloaded a random list on the internet. Now I want a robot to call out and sell all those people." Well, you're going to get sued out of existence. First of all, it's not going to work. And second of all, you get sued out of existence. So, we're working with what we're really working on there is less the tech and more like making sure that you can't dump a list in and we make sure that the proper compliance is there because particularly in the US, you have to actually say yes, I am willing to let a robot call me. But, out voice AI is in the works and that's awesome. And then we're also coming out with an agentic builder uh that you'll see at level update which is our big uh event in Dallas in October. And then that's going to be really that's to me that's the next big phase on the in the agency world. You're going to stop selling you know the end product and you're going to start selling the thing that creates the end product. Right? And the thing is everybody's going to talk about aentic builders but here's the here's the big secret. All the big companies out there who are creating these agentic builders, they're selling them to the small businesses. And this is very similar to back in the day when they were selling CRM to small businesses. They're going to small business saying, "Hey, Mr. plumber, Mr. Lawyer, Mr. Doctor, Mr. Denny, buy a CRM. It will magically make you money." And we all know what happened there. They bought the CRM. The CRM just looks at them. It's like, "All right, well, I'm a tool. I'm a hammer. I'm a saw. Now get to work, build the house." And the plumber, the lawyer, the doctor, the dentist, they do an actual job. So, they don't have time to also pick up another job called marketing, which is really a big deal. Well, a agents are AI agents are going to be the same way fundamentally. Will the a will the dentist want a receptionist agent that can make inbound calls, outbound calls, confirm appointments, make appointments, all these things? Of course they will. But will they have a clue how to train those agents, build those agents, continue to evolve those agents over time? No. They will have no idea. That's where the agency comes in to strike back. The agency is going to be the person that's going to walk in and sell that. And yet again, they're not going to sell the tool. They're not going to say, "Hi, I'm here to sell you an AI agent." No one has any clue what that that means. They're going to say, "Hey, I'm here to get all of your inbound calls answered, make outbound calls for you automatically, book appointments for you automatically. Would that save you a lot of time, make you a lot of money? Heck yeah. Okay, great." And boom, the a the agency comes in, makes the pitch, makes the sale, and then does the implementation. And off the back of that is going to create a beautiful recurring revenue stream. Um and the same will be said for social media posting, for website creation, all the things. All of that will be handled by agents, but the agencies will be the ones to create them to uh you know to train them and evolve them over time and use them to make the sale and and help create outcomes for their clients, which is really at the end of the day all the way back to what is an agency and what do we do? We try to create outcomes for our clients. Our clients want more customers, right? They don't care that, you know, we we might be really nerdy and like love websites and love social media this and blah blah blah, but no offense, the customers you serve, they don't care. They could give a crap. They want to know what the outcome is. And for them, it's uh it's getting more customers. And it's no different, you know, when we go to the dentist. I mean, maybe some of us are like, "Oh, could you tell me what what what tools you use? What what what kind of filling are you going to be using on my teeth today?" I I'm sure there's an odd person out there, but the vast majority of us are just like, "Ow, this hurts. Can you fix it? Cool. Thanks. And that's what

the most common issues uh business owners comes to me are for leads. They they're like, "We cannot find a good list of leads." Uh how?

Of course. Yeah.

So is go high levels.

You say like, here's what you say. You say, "All right, it's 2 a.m. on a Christmas morning and a hot lead call calls in. Who's there at your business to swoop them up and book them on on the calendar?" You know what the answer to that is? Nobody. And and and you know what's worse? At at five minutes after you close, when you're out on a job every single day, you know who's there to close those things? Nobody. That you don't need more leads. Mr. Business owner, Mrs. Business Owner, you need something to take the leads you're missing right now and close them. You know how many people come to your website every single day and then look at your website and then leave? Tons. You know why? Because no one's there to help them. If they were, you would without paying a single dime in more ads and more u you know, more Facebook ads, more billboards, whatever the heck you're doing. How about instead we just take the existing ads you're currently running, the existing traffic you have today, and let's just get more sales out of that. How about that? Uh for the people listening, one incredible thing that happened. I signed up on GoHigh level and when once you sign up, there's an onboarding and you get added to a Zoom waiting room and there's just like people onboarding people left and right and I saw that and I was like this, they've actually made it into a conveyor belt. Well, I mean what we know is that when people when we get on and help people by having calls like that with them, they do so much better in terms of their ult ultimate outcomes because you know the faster again speed to lead is really what this is all about. I don't care who you're serving and what you do at some point if your mission in life is to help somebody. If you're putting them in a line or putting them in a queue or making them wait or telling them you get back to them later, they're not going to feel helped. So the sooner you can get back to them, the better. And that's what it's all about. Whether you're an agency or a plumber or a software company, that is exactly what you should be doing.

Wow. And u we we talked about AI, we talked about AI agents. Um in your website, do you do you how do you what do you mean when you say you should serve customers when they come to your website? Do you mean by a chatbot or like how would how

Yeah, exactly. AI chat. So like everybody, you know, like everybody knows that thing down in the bottom right hand corner says, "Hey, I'm over here. I can help." That is like a hey, I can help. That's like a hey, you looked at the website, you have a question, come on down. And if you use AI there, right? Instead of the old school like, hey, could you wait? Or I'll get back to you or an agent. No one wants to do that, right? But AI, you know, most people, it's, this is the fun part about it. Most people have the same questions, right? Like, how much does it cost? Or how does it work? Or how soon can you do this? Or whatever it is. Like there's a very similar style of question. And then and the reality is is they want to take that next step. So the idea is like if you can answer that question and then of course with AI these days it's it's it's not just like Q&A. It's not like how much does it cost $50 and then it just sits there and looks at you. It can say oh that's 50 bucks. Would you like to book a call? Would you like to book an appointment? And all of a sudden you're you're pulling people down the funnel and you're getting them booked. And once you do that I mean that's just money in the bank for most businesses. I mean most businesses would tell you if you can get me a booked appointment I can turn that into money. So, if you can get someone to walk in the dentist's office, most of the time they'll leave with the filling. The dentist knows what to do with that or the lawn care guy or the whatever business will know what to do with a booked appointment. They won't know what to do prior to that. And that's where the agency really comes in and shines.

One of the greatest opportunities right now is short form video. And we're seeing now doctors becoming content creators. Everyone is becoming a short form video creator. How do you think about short form video? Um, it sounds sounds good to me. I mean, there's lots of ways to do it. Um, I don't think I think it's just another uh, you know, this is a great example of kind of the evolution of things, right? So, you know, whether it's like, oh, well, there's this thing that called Tik Tok that wasn't here a minute ago, now exists. You better be putting content out there. I don't think short form I think short form is just another content format that we all need to embrace. And it's maybe just a good example of people's lack of attention and their inability to sustain any kind of attention span. So it's just a shifting of the of how you need to do it. But I don't know that let let's say you were helping a client do content creation prior to me. This is just another amalgamation of that. And I know like for example for our team they will take my longer form content and they'll turn it into shorter form content. And my expectation is that's what a good agency is doing. But again you can just use AI to do all that stuff that way.

Yeah. One thing I like about uh so you must have seen Alex Hermosi investing in school community like the school.com and that was a really good investment in my opinion because school as a platform is so sticky because you the community itself promotes the school platform and I I feel like the same way about go high level too. I think it's a very sticky software because once you've already onboarded all your company's information, it's really hard to switch. So kudos to you. Well, I mean we we didn't come up with this ourselves. I mean we we followed our customers. I mean we always follow our customers. So you know we our our our job at high level isn't to come up with the next greatest idea because we have the best marketers in the world it as our customers. I mean, I bar none, I would I would I'd go pound-for-pound. You pick a you pick the best marketer in the world, and I guarantee you they use high level. And what's great about that is that they're the ones who tell us what the new things are or how to change the software or what to implement. And we follow our customer. We don't think of ourselves as like super geniuses in the marketing world. In fact, the opposite. We think of ourselves as the worst marketers in the world, the worst sales people in the world, but for what we're do bad, we do something great, which is we're awesome product people and awesome engineers. So you put those two together and magic can happen. And I think a lot of companies try to sort of feel like they have to own it all. But I think that's a terrible idea because nobody can be great at everything. So but you know it's sort of like you know if you wanted to if you want to run faster my advice is go go run alongside the fastest runners in the world. You'll pick some stuff up and over time you will run faster. You may not run as fast as they can but fundamentally you will run a lot faster than you otherwise would. And for us that's how we think about our customers. I mean they are the best marketers in the world. So, if you want to build the best marketing software in the world, you know, know the best marketers and and get their get their best ideas. Um, and then our job is to go out and turn that into software for them to go out and use and serve their clients. And then anybody else who just walks in, you know, who doesn't know what the best marketing software in the world looks like, they just get it by default because of all these awesome people who've kind of come before them to help make that happen.

And a lot of people are afraid right now AI is going to replace their jobs. Um, what do you tell those people? Well, I mean, I think AI will replace some jobs. That's for sure. Um, but I think it's it depends on who I'm talking to. If you're if you're the person who wants to go out and serve a bunch of clients, what a great day for you because I've talked to a lot of agencies. I want to I've watched a lot of people go from zero to zero to one in the agency space. And man, it's difficult because it starts off with, okay, you are you are everything, right? You are the you are the salesperson, you are the marketer, you are the oh, and you're the implement too, by the way. When you get your client, you're doing all the work. And then all of a sudden it used to be okay well what's the answer to the next step? Well because I want to scale more right well I would say well you need to focus on sales and marketing. Well who does all the implementation? Well it used to be you have to go hire someone to do that. Well that's hard right? Who do because a lot of times you've gotten really good you know your clients. You're doing great work and there's a lot of fear about hiring that first person and oftentimes some truth in it. They're not going to do as good of a job as you did and all of a sudden they're going to put your client relationships at risk. Well, guess what? AI is here to actually do it the way you want it done and you can find and create consistencies there. So, personally, if your mission is to become an entrepreneur, if your mission is to scale a business, AI is absolutely your friend. Now, I think if your job is to do something that's somewhat repetitive, yeah, AI is coming for you and you better you better get moving. Otherwise, AI will replace you. And I think this is true across the board. I mean, if you're the entry level law law clerk, if you're the entry level whatever, um AI, those tend to be repetitive jobs because you're learning something brand new. And unfortunately, AI is coming for you. Um that's not how it's going to work in the long term. You're going to have to you're either going to have to have a a bunch more basic skill sets or you're going to have to just get a lot deeper in your skill set to outpace AI. But if you're an entrepreneurreneur who is who we deal with, our marketing agency, wow, AI is the best the best thing you've ever seen in your entire life. Yeah. The problem is the international offshoring talent is catching up to the US entry- level talent because of AI.

Yeah.

And that's where there there's a whole whole discrepancy happening. And we saw Trump like announcing that they're going to ban Indian IT companies to outsource work to India which is like the story happening for hundreds of years.

Yeah. I mean I I yeah I guess so. I mean good luck with that. I mean, I think I think at the end of the day, AI is AI is going to come for all that work anyways. So, I mean, you know, I f first of all, he can say whatever he wants and try to do whatever he wants. Technology will out clearly outpace anything he thinks he can write up and sign in an afternoon. That's not going to have an impact in my opinion. But what I think really is going to have an impact is AI. I mean, and I think that in reality, I think the the offshore quoteunquote idea will start to go away because I think a lot of those folks will be the authors of a lot of those agents. And now we're going to get in this a agent talent war. And it's not going to be about what country is your person from. It's going to be how good is your AI agent? And I don't really care who created it. I just care how good it is. And I think this is going to create a lot of innovation around training these different agents for these different roles um and creating these different outcomes. And I think it's really the question the question you should be asking is how much AI am I using and and how do I make that a higher percentage because um that ultimately is going to go from oh wow isn't that cool to table stakes? I mean if you're not doing it you're out of business. Good luck.

Uh while we wrap up can you give some highlevel advice for entrepreneurs? Uh it could be about discipline or it could be about like daily habits or it could be something about uh how business business owners can get kind of distracted or get that shiny object syndrome. Uh can you talk a little bit about that?

Well, I would just say the people that I work with in general, the biggest piece of advice I always give them is focus on the sale. Um you know, we we you know, a lot of our again I'm biased. We have a customer base that's coming in to learn a tool. But my biggest piece of advice is like learn the very basics and and and I and you know inbound voice AI is a great one. Just pick one feature, learn it and go make the sale and keep making the sale and repeat the sale. Sale sale sale because that's the thing that cannot be automated, cannot be learned. You cannot do it behind your computer. Um you know that's the biggest challenge I see for most people. Um and then realize that it's all success comes with consistency, right? It's super boring. It's, you know, all the failures up front, which is always the tough part. Like, we're all the worst when we first started something. I don't care if you're you're learning a new language or trying to learn an instrument or you're trying to start a business. Fundamentally, you will always be the worst on day one. And so, it's just hard for people with the most discou the discouragement's frontloaded. But realize that you're you really are compounding um over time. And it just takes a lot of repetition to get where you're going. And you're going to have lots of points where you you feel blocked and this and this and this. But just realize that it's consistency over time that create success, not some big new idea, not some silver bullet. And the people out there who are advertising it as such, most of them have something to sell you, which is why they're trying to appeal to your nature. It's kind of like, you know, every uh, you know, every year I see like get six-pack abs in six seconds or six minutes or six hours or whatever it is. But fundamentally, it all it all tends to boil down to doing a lot of hard work, which is why they're always selling new ones every year because they keep selling it to people who want who who buy into the promise and then quit when they find out there's a lot of work to it. Um, and that's how it is with everything in life. So, if if you feel like gosh, it's taking forever. It does take time. But don't worry, every day you consistently move in in that direction, you will get better and you will create breakthroughs. But where you lose is when you quit and you decide, oh, this is too hard or I just don't have the magic sauce or whatever it is. There is no magic sauce. It is just about being consistent every day, staying at your craft and learning from the losses and really just evolving as you go forward.

And how can people find you and how can people sign up for go high level?

Well, then just go to the website and all that. um that's fine. But the best way to look at High Level uh is just go to YouTube and search High Level and go look at our YouTube channel because you know you don't have to sign up for anything. You don't have to do anything. You can look at all the content. You can see software stuff. You can look at uh interviews we do with creators and marketers and people who are using High Level. So you can get a really good I think uh perspective on who we are and what we do.

Amazing. Thank you so much Sean for being generous with your time. Thank you for coming on.

Yeah, no worries man. Thanks for having me.